What Does Satan Mean To You?


1. Mär. 2006, 20:58

So, I just bought Words That Go Unspoken, Deeds That Go Undone. It's a two disc set, including a DVD that includes some oddball band interviews.

I'm a relative newbie to black metal, and as such my exposure is pretty minimal. I've done a little homework, and find that the sub-genre goes back to bands like Venom, Bathory, and Celtic Frost et.al. From there, we apparently get into Emperor, Immortal, Burzum, and Darkthrone et.al. Then there's a fork in the road somehow, and we go off in the direction of Dimmu Borgir and Cradle of Filth, which I understand to be theater bands, rather than "real black metal". Or so the fans appear to say.

I don't know much more than that. It appears to me that black metal has a very few things that must be true to qualify as "black". Subject matter revolving around Satanism is one, or at the very least occult. There is some question about production quality, vocal character, and whether or not one employs keyboards. Hallmarks of "real" black metal appear to be horrible production value, crappy sound, screaming, and silly costumes. Some of the music is pretty cool, most of it sounds like shit to me.

Akercocke appears to qualify as a sort of "progressive black metal". I've read them described as "A thinking man's black metal". They play well, have high production value, and fairly melodic and musical song structures.

All of these questions of defining the sub-genre are interesting and all, but not really why I write. I really want to know about Satanism.

On the Akercocke DVD, it seems clear that the band have a fairly decent sense of humor. The interviewer is a nutjob Italian character who's kind of funny, but the real clue is seeing the drummer, David Gray, in a full blown Darth Vader costume, drumming. Star Wars fandom appears here and there.

One of the questions is, "What would you do for Satan?" to which David responds, "All I do, I do for Satan." with a sort of knowing, dark grin. Their web site has all sorts of postings about "Hail our lord Satan" and this and that.

What I really want to know then, is what is this Satanism thing all about? Is it a joke? When you read their site, and their lyrics, it all comes of as very serious. Then you see the DVD and it all comes off as kind of silly.

I mean, Akercocke appear to carry themselves like "real" Satanists. But, I mean, really? Does one drum in a Darth Vader costume "for Satan"? And seriously, could Satanism possibly be a pratical source of day to day ethics?

I'm an agnostic personally, and don't believe in God or Satan. But it seems to me that the Satan thing is either a gimmick, or a religion that I really don't understand at all. I mean, worshippers of the Cthulhu mythos would prostrate themselves to evil in hopes of minimizing their suffering when the Old Ones came to destroy the world. Satanists come off as sort of unsure of themselves. Do they wish favor from the Great Dark One? Or do they want to be jerks? Or do they want to stab people, burn buildings down and cause mayhem? What is the motivation for "doing all one does for Satan"?

Does one hold down a job as a Satanist? Or go grocery shopping? Or play football? I don't get it. Can some one educate me? Any Satanists here?

The Akercocke album is pretty good, by the way.


  • Hamwork

    They're Satanists. But it doesn't mean they're not allowed a sense of humour, basically. Akercocke take it more lightly than most bands do. In the traditional Norwegian black metal scene, you're not a true BM band until you've burnt a church down, practically. I dunno what else to add. When it comes down to it, I think none of them are really 'Satanists' - they more just oppose God and, more to the point, religion in the strongest manner.

    1. Mär. 2006, 23:03
  • Hamwork

    Bit of a weak reply, but I'm just back from the pub, so forgive me =)

    1. Mär. 2006, 23:03
  • Kindjal

    Isn't Satanism a religion of its own accord? I mean, if you opposed religion, you'd be an agnostic, or an anti-theist I guess. Worshipping Satan is still a religion. This topic is best discussed at the pub, in fact. I think I'll go get a cold one myself.

    1. Mär. 2006, 23:38
  • tanzeelat

    According to wikipedia, Satanism is a religious, semi-religious and/or philosophical movement whose adherents recognize Satan as an archetype, pre-cosmic force, actual living entity, or some aspect of human nature. I think that's as definitive an answer you're ever to get on that question. I saw Akercocke live last December. They were supporting Opeth. I remember hearing them described as Satan's bankers, and certainly every song they played featured the word Satan in the chorus.

    2. Mär. 2006, 13:08
  • petrifiedrandy

    it really doesn't mean anything actually..

    2. Mär. 2006, 14:13
  • Friedel

    Every religion sucks, if you belive in satan or someone else. They just want to control you and incite you against the other side. And i really don't care what some musicians say about god or whomever. If i like the music, i like the music... If it black metal or white metal, i don't give a fuck. If you really need someone to believe in, believe in YOU!

    8. Mär. 2006, 0:28
  • Friedel

    Religion is the opium of the masses.

    8. Mär. 2006, 0:29
  • Friedel

    But believing in satan is still believing.... If it's god or satan! I would rather call it Atheism... ;)

    8. Mär. 2006, 1:58
  • Friedel

    BTW Karl Marx said: Religion is the opium of the masses.

    8. Mär. 2006, 2:00
  • Friedel

    Ok, i've read it... It's satanism under the influence of atheism but still have all those symbols and statements. And it circles around satan. so it's a religion and i don't need it. There is no god, if you call him the lord, buddha, satan or whatever you want. Whatever you say: If it included satan, you are religious. And why do people need someone like high priest john? To preach them what to do or not? If you don't belive in satan, why call it satanism? [quote]being a satanist is to me a way to reject religion.[/quote] reject religion with religion...

    8. Mär. 2006, 11:29
  • Kindjal

    Informative link, Glen. Thanks. It's too long for me to read in one sitting, but a first skim answers some questions and raises others. I'll save them for some later time. In short, it seems to me that Satanism contains a number of contradictory elements. One who is really concerned with finding the truth should consider being a scientist. I often wonder why people are so enfatuated with the mystical/religious, when the real (as discovered through science) is so much more rewarding and revealing.

    8. Mär. 2006, 15:59
  • Friedel

    [quote]...but when you say your an satanist to a christian its much funnier...[/quote] And at that point you're totally right. *lol

    12. Mär. 2006, 3:25
  • Kindjal

    @Behemoth418: Science has plenty of responsibility and spirituality. Capitalism is that beast which is lacking in both, and is what you should blame for our dying Earth. Science is the search for answers, the why and how of our reality. How it might be applied is Engineering, and how to make money with it is sales and marketing. That last thing is where we get into trouble.

    20. Mär. 2006, 15:53
  • elnimio

    They aren't even black metal.... They're definitely as death metal as it gets. Maybe some blakc influences here and there but not really. Great band though.

    31. Mär. 2006, 23:24
  • viewofeverlast

    I've never heard an athiest called a satanist...

    6. Jul. 2006, 18:36
  • Kindjal

    I've sort of stopped paying attention to this thread. It's been a while. I did ask, What does Satanism [b]mean to you[/b] but to be honest, I'm a little disappointed. Atheism isn't Satanism. Neither is agnosticism. Neither is rationality. Neither is belief in science (whatever that means). Neither is, Opposing Christianity. I started the thread because Akercocke seemed kinda scary to me. So did Behemoth and some other black metal bands that seem to espouse belief in Satan, whatever it means to them. But now some time has gone by and I've looked more into it. Now, more than anything, Satanism seems mostly just a joke. Niether scary, nor particularly believable, and in particular not very practical, not to mention illogical. I am now not taking any Satanist seriously, nor any black metal band. I take it more for thematics in the musical sense I guess. And if you're a Satanist, well, be my guest, but I feel the same way about you as I do about other theists, that is to say, self-important and delusional, except that in your case, you won't mind if someone stronger than you hurts you or screws you over.

    6. Jul. 2006, 20:15
  • metalmicky

    and thats ultimately whats its all about. I think that Satanism is a reaction to religion and a form of plausable opposition.Its like a badge that says , 'I reject religion'. The concept of a mangod or manbeast is not how I see it, as I don't believe either exists. Its more of a protest against a society which indoctrinates our children with the concept of faith from an early age, rather than teaching self respect and consideration for the rest of humanity and our enviroment, and the concept that you dael with problems that occur in life, rather than pray to a God that will sort the problem for you. Anton LaVey's Satanic Bible is an interesting read for how some percieve Satanism, and this resonates in some way to how I live life.So in essence, its more of a lifestyle belief than any religious undertaking.

    25. Aug. 2006, 12:08
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